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If the vaccine is optional, will you take it?

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    If the vaccine is optional, will you take it?

    Votes are anonymous.
    12
    Yes
    58.33%
    7
    No
    41.67%
    5

    #2
    There's nothing optional about the vaccine when the government suggests that your freedom will be extremely limited if you choose not to take it


    Comment


      #3
      to whoever voted no, what exactly are you concerned with ?

      Comment


        #4
        I'll be one of the absolute last people to take the vaccine.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Talk Sick View Post
          to whoever voted no, what exactly are you concerned with ?
          That it doesn't work and that the world is turning into a police state.



          Dude disabled comments, and then erased the post. He should be embarrassed.

          Comment


            #6
            so the governmant can microchip me and turn me into a transgender who wants sharia law?

            no thanks pal.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by oldtyme View Post
              so the governmant can microchip me and turn me into a transgender who wants sharia law?

              no thanks pal.
              i know you're kidding but what's the difference between a microchip and a vaccine passport

              Comment


              • oldtyme
                oldtyme commented
                Editing a comment
                how do you know I'm kidding?



                as a child you have an immunization record which you have to show when enrolling in school daycare etc. This is no different.
                Last edited by oldtyme; 09-21-2021, 11:46 AM.

              #8
              Originally posted by Guile View Post

              i know you're kidding but what's the difference between a microchip and a vaccine passport
              This is just my take:

              The first thing to clear up is what the microchip does: but for the sake of argument I'm assuming any microchip at its absolute worst and assume it monitors your every movement and regulates all of what you can and can't do in the public and private sphere. I'm also assuming the widespread scientific consensus is correct being (a) that the vaccine is safe for the vast majority of people and (b) taking it is effective at reducing infection and severity of COVID-19.

              In that case, the differences that I can think of are the following:

              The passport doesn't monitor your every movement, you only need it in certain specific situations in the public sphere. It doesn't effect your private life at all unless the people around you make it, in which case, friends can always talk it out.

              The passport targets access to luxury services, and so limits only a very small portion overall of what you are going to be able to do on a daily basis. The actual effect on the day to day life of most people is going to be negligible because the type of services that are going to become unavailable are ones that most people couldn't access on a regular basis anyway, purely due to the cost involved. It should be noted that many of the services that are covered by the passport are things that were already inaccessible to a lot of people simply because of cost.

              (As an aside, the concerns about the passport creating a "two-tiered society" seem misguided given that we already have a multi-tiered society based upon earnings. Those arguments are squarely aimed at a very specific portion of the middle-class and play off fears of becoming the outgroup in society. It assumes that the passport will create the outgroup, when in fact the outgroup actually already exists and includes the poor and the working poor who can't afford to access the services the middle-class can. Some people who buy into this argument just don't really "see" the poor people around them when they are thinking about their "loss of liberty". "Loss of liberty" in these circumstances is better understood as "loss of the ability to spend my money exactly the way I want." My point with this digression is only to highlight that society was unequal before the introduction of the passports and those who are worried about not being able to access services without the jab should consider the fact that the people who work in the restaurants they want to go to may have had the jab and still can't afford to eat at there. At least when I think about the issue in that context, it makes it very difficult to find sympathy for the person who is complaining as in my experience, they are more often than not, people who are not economically disadvantaged and are totally able to make their own fun if they want to.)

              The microchip (I assume) doesn't have an alternative. The passport has Skipthedishes or literally any other form of takeout for food. For other entertainment, you can still party at home and watch DJ Marky stream on Twitch like I have for the last 18 months. It doesn't seem like indoor clubbing is in the cards soon, so it seems unlikely that anyone is going to miss out on that because of the introduction of the passport.

              A microchip is forever and the vaccine is only actually in your body for a few days.

              Requiring vaccinations in order to access services is already standard practice in Ontario because your child can be suspended from school if they fail to have their vaccinations kept up to date, so requiring it for adults in an emergency situation is not a stretch by any standard when you think about conceptions of Canadian freedom. The general consensus is that if you take the principled position that you do not want to vaccinate your kid, then you have to homeschool them and accept all the responsibility that comes with it, that's the trade-off you take for making that decision. The trade-off with the vax passport is that you get to keep your conception of bodily integrity and in exchange you can no longer access some of the things that you like in the way that you used to. Put like that, you can see that we are in the same ballpark with this comparison. A microchip, by alternative, would be a very big departure from what already exists in the real world.

              All of this only speaks to the difference between vaccine passports/certificates and microchips. Nobody take this as me endorsing anyone enduring economic hardship like losing their job due to not getting the vaccine, that particular issue is a completely different one that is definitely way more complicated.

              But yeah, those are the differences that I can think of.
              Last edited by J.Freeman; 09-21-2021, 12:07 PM.

              Comment


                #9
                how do you know I'm kidding?
                because sharia and trannies don't mix.


                as a child you have an immunization record which you have to show when enrolling in school daycare etc. This is no different.
                not even close, you don't have to show your yellow immunization record when you go to restaurants, gyms, airports. my yellow card is probably still in my dad's garage, where i left it 6-7 years ago, because literally no one asks for it.

                Comment


                • oldtyme
                  oldtyme commented
                  Editing a comment
                  you're right you don't carry around your yellow booklet because the instances of unvaccinated people for these diseases in those settings is nil. this isnt the case with covid which as we all are aware we have an active global pandemic related to.

                  I would expect if we have an outbreak of tuberculosis you might need to produce evidence of vaccination past a certain threshold of cases/ active infections.

                  i get it, these are draconian measures, what is the alternative to having our businesses and daily lives return to some form of what things were like pre-2020? we just all work out and spend 20 hours on a flight with a mask on? If the alternative is do nothing and trust people to govern themselves in a non-selfish way I just dont have that kind of faith in people anymore.
                  Last edited by oldtyme; 09-22-2021, 10:47 AM.

                #10
                Originally posted by J.Freeman View Post

                This is just my take:

                TLDR
                Jeez dood.. it was a rhetorical question. What I was getting at is that they are both there to control you in certain ways. I would actually argue that the QR code is worse than a chip because you willingly submitted to it, whereas a chip could be installed against your will.

                Comment


                  #11
                  Originally posted by Guile View Post

                  Jeez dood.. it was a rhetorical question. What I was getting at is that they are both there to control you in certain ways. I would actually argue that the QR code is worse than a chip because you willingly submitted to it, whereas a chip could be installed against your will.
                  Sorry mate. I get in the mood to pontificate in the morning. It's a bad habit that I'm trying to stop. But that is a very good point that you make.
                  Last edited by J.Freeman; 09-21-2021, 05:32 PM.

                  Comment


                    #12
                    Originally posted by J.Freeman View Post

                    Sorry mate. I get in the mood to pontificate in the morning. But that is a very good point.
                    all good man, i wasn't putting you down, you make good points too, but i think this is more than just about a vaccine. im not even an anti-vaxxer, i just don't like where this is going from a more general view. being traced and digitally assassinated is like some shit out of Time Cop.

                    Comment


                      #13
                      Originally posted by Guile View Post

                      all good man, i wasn't putting you down, you make good points too, but i think this is more than just about a vaccine. im not even an anti-vaxxer, i just don't like where this is going from a more general view. being traced and digitally assassinated is like some shit out of Time Cop.
                      Yeah man I feel you with that sort of general dystopian vibe. The advent of things like 23andme has made movies like Gattica seem like a real possibility. I guess the vax passport just doesn't hit the right buttons to send a warning signal for me.
                      Last edited by J.Freeman; 09-21-2021, 08:52 PM.

                      Comment


                        #14
                        Originally posted by Guap Chachi View Post
                        There's nothing optional about the vaccine when the government suggests that your freedom will be extremely limited if you choose not to take it

                        and here we are today....

                        Comment


                          #15
                          Originally posted by Guap Chachi View Post

                          and here we are today....
                          Has anyone had to show their certificate yet? I haven't left the house in two days so I don't know what has changed on the ground.

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